Look familiar? This re-imagining of Treyarch’s classic “Banzai” from World at War drops players into the center of a post-apocalyptic battleground. As water sources dry up, two competing factions fight to maintain their supply. Take control of the key bridge, fortresses, tunnel systems, and waterfalls to survive in the high-stakes wasteland of Verge.

SHARE
  • inick1

    Furst? 😛 JK I’m FIRST 😀

  • Scott

    2nd

  • CrazyWolf

    THIRD! Ah…close enough…

  • jordanxbrookes

    Should’ve brought back Castle not Banzai 😐

    • Tuby

      Castle was good. Also love the map with the metro station forgot the name

      • Dr. Salim

        The map with the metro station is Station.

    • Ak74u

      It’s not as easy when they bring back a map into bo3 they have to look the movement system and see how it fits in with the map. For example hijacked was a great map in bo2 and it’s still a great map in bo3 but the movement doesn’t fit the map so well it feels like it ruins the flow of the map. I’d like any old map but I’m afraid if it will be messed up by the movement system

      • Siftblade

        Yeah, well the movement system messes pretty much everything up

  • ScOott

    No article informing everyone about the black market black out? No C.I supporting it? .. Does activisons dick taste good? I hope so for ur sake..

    • 000000

      In fairness, CI is only a news website, not an activist group. It’s not their job to report anything unless Activision respond – official news.
      On saying that, I completely disagree with the badly designed rarity system in supply drops and action needs to be taken against it.

      • ScOott

        It’ doesn’t have to come through activisons mouth for CI to report a story.. Im not saying they should be an activist group, but to simply report what’s happening..

        • Trinityvitaliaty

          It really doesn’t matter.It’s not there role.

          • ScOott

            Because they choose it not to be..

            It’s not my role to not open up any supply drops but I’m going to do it

            it wasnt Lunator100hd, or Ak74u role to inform me of what was going on but they did..

            It wasn’t the big YouTubers roll to inform them of what was happening but he did..

            Your logic makes little scene, everyone has a role to play if they choose to, the more people who spread the word the better and if c.i spread the word that would be huge.

          • Trinityvitaliaty

            First of all:I never said I agreed with supply drops,I firmly dislike them.Secondly:C.I is a news outlet that has the right to the first ammendment or lack there of,choosing articles they feel best represent there brand.Also,if the black market is down it can only be for a short time and maybe 10 minutes or so from the time it happened to the time C.I reports-it had already been fixed. I come here for headlines not to sift through a saturated irrelevant forum/news website.

          • ScOott

            What? .. you have read everything wrong..

          • darren

            No, anyone who comes here often enough know to skip your “comments”

          • ScOott

            What? Lol I must of made u butt hurt in someway I apologise lol..

        • Johtoboy

          They could make an article about all the big youtubers speaking out against supply drops. And post their videos underneath the article.

          • darren

            All those youtubers who complain about it, all have the new weapons. I don’t need youtube to tell me which way the wind blows.

        • darren

          I’m sorry people. This is not news. There is some belly-aching going on. How is today or yesterday different from 5 months ago? None. I’m sorry if everyone thought that supply drops were gonna be one thing, and turned out to be another. I knew they were bullshit before the melee weapons went in. And guess what, I’ll bet you would still belly-ache if things changed. That is what people really want.

      • Psychomaggot105

        You must not have read the article with ci’s idea for fan supported winnings for cod tournaments then?

        • CoDforever

          You must have not read the article with CI’s idea about removing weapons from supply drops?

          • Psychomaggot105

            I just stated they do have opinion articles not just news related.

          • CoDforever

            exactly, their “opinion” pieces. And their opinions arent going to be what you want them to think.

    • TheDemonOfHate

      Just because they didn’t put out an article about doesn’t clearly mean that they support Activision. They already put out an article on how they could fix supply drops. #Trump2016 #FeelTheBern

      • ScOott

        I’ve been here a very long time, keshav will not say a bad word about Activision cuz they have a bunch of hands and dicks up his ass.. He constantly argues in favour of them on e-sprorts, on micro dlc, on any subject what so ever, so protesting about the black market was never going to happen. I was just seeing if he could pull his dick away for a few minutes to write an article..

        To ask the number one place for CoD news to do an article on a peice of cod news where YouTubers are advising to avoid the black market isn’t much to ask for? It’s a news story at the end of the day, it should get reported.. If he likes or not.. But because he doesn’t want his best friends giving him a spanking he won’t..

        • Orated perfectly; it’s a news article, and such a story shouldn’t even hurt the site’s reputation with Activision anyways since this is actually happening within the community, and thus, is not the site’s fault. Don’t hurt the messenger.

          Really, if Activision ordered the site to remove that article, it will help fuel the cause of what the fans are trying to achieve right now. Not only this, but people don’t want Activision to inspire a legion of monsters to follow their path.

          • Keshav Bhat

            Activision does not ask us to remove an article that reflects them negatively.

            They only ask us to remove materials that are copyright (including leaks, videos, image leaks, etc.)

        • Keshav Bhat

          First: I do not understand how you want me to ever reply or care what you have to say when you use such comparisons and act rude. Most of the people I follow will tell you are an annoying troll and should be banned from here; I agree a lot of times.

          Second: as I said before, I have clearly outlined my opinion already in an article. I don’t understand what you missed in the article I wrote a while back? I don’t support weapons being in Black Market. I never had; I never spent money on COD Points, never will.

          Third: You’ll never understand what we all have to think through before posting anything. You’re not the only reader here; I never try to appease to one reader. I have to appease to everyone.

          Fourth: I don’t understand how me defending eSports is bad? I watch CS:GO, Halo, CoD, LoL, and many more titles…I enjoy esports across games. So, just because you don’t like eSports doesn’t mean that me liking it makes me “dick riding” Activision. Over 228,000 people watched the CWL Finals on Sunday. Are they all Activision dick riders?

          So, if you don’t agree with me, fine. I could care less what you think about me anymore; I used to take some insults personally, but now, I could care less. CI started 5 years ago with us having a passion for Call of Duty, and that’s it. I still love Call of Duty because it is the franchise that brought me into video games on console. I played Pokemon, etc. before. I’ll continue to post my opinions on how I think, not how you want me to think.

          • ScOott

            I can imagine u have a long list of people who would love to see me banned, but that’ doesn’t make me a troll, or Infact deserved to be banned, I love cod just as much as u, I have over 5days played on bo3. See ur taking everything personal, instead of looking at it objectively..ur chucking the idea away cuz u don’t care for the YouTuber u don’t like how he started it and he hasnt got a good track record..

            I know n nothing about the guy, don’t watch his videos, so I can say even if he is a complete nob jockey, it’s a good idea, I dont see how u can’t deny that..

          • Keshav Bhat

            I’m chucking the idea away because: (1) I don’t support a black out of customization content, (2) it’s not going to work because people who have enough disposable income to buy CoD Points will continue to do so because they want too, (3) when people who strongly disagree with this idea see this, they’ll be inclined to spend more money on points, wasting our time, and (4) because I am not going to make a post linking to YouTube videos from other people (for reasons I will not discuss). People can make up their own minds and do what they please. Who am I to tell anyone how to spend their money?

          • ScOott

            Ur missing the point,the whole thing is to help the people spending money.. Tmarnt has spent over a thousand dollars and not got all the weapons, lucky for him he ain’t going to miss it, but for ur average person that’ is insane!

            The whole purpose of this is to get better odds and help the community, but u can’t see that so carrying this on is a waste of time.. P.s never asked u to post any videos..

          • HenryDF

            No, you can’t see that he has to treat this objectively and has to continue to treat this site as a news site. It’s not the job of the people who run this site to promote activism. They report the news and, occasionally, we’ll get opinion pieces on news too.

            Simply because they don’t talk about something like the Black Market Blackout doesn’t mean that they “suck Activision dick”. Grow up man. Look at the bigger picture and stop embarrassing yourself.

          • ScOott

            Il just upvote u cuz if ur to stupid to realise that it’s a good idea than I have no more time to waste..

          • HenryDF

            I have no idea what you mean.

          • ScOott

            Exactly lol..

          • Mr_ysi42t96

            I don’t think black out is going to work anyways because lots of kids will spend their parents money on supply drops. I actually can’t see why people can’t stop spending money on black market to try and get something that’s you’re not gurantted to get. It depends on each individual. Plus activision will not remove it because it’s already implemented if you know what I mean

          • ScOott

            No one is asking for them to remove it, just to get better odds the. Spend a thousand dollars and still not get all the weapons In paid game is crazy..

          • Mr_ysi42t96

            No man it should be removed for those who don’t have control over themselves. Seriously people spend money on something they can get over by collecting more kryptokeys. This is stupid, it’s the communities fault for spending money. For now I’ve seen soo many people have all the extra taunts and guns and I think to myself how stupid these people are for spending money on something they might not get for a MICRO dlc

          • darren

            Shit, I was supposed to spend a thousand on this game? Guess I got some work to do.

            And by the way, if you spend a thousand dollar on this game, I hope you get nothing. And I hope you have the balls to piss and moan about it after. I fucking dare you.

            That “guy” who spent a thousand dollars on supply drops, drives an R8. I’m supposed to feel bad? That asshole is the reasons the odds are that way. Why drop shit at a 10% rate, when you’ve got a bunch of idiots who will drop thousands and don’t care. Guess how he got his R8? By playing video games, and charging people to say something to him in real time. I’m sorry. It isn’t the game. It isn’t the company. It’s idiots who pay idiots to play a game. I watched Noahj for about an hour a couple weeks ago. In that time, he made almost $200, in “donations.” And that was just that hour. His streams are usually like 3-4 hours. Why should this asshole stop bying supply drops when idiots are literally throwing money at him? The problem goes beyond gaming.

          • ScOott

            I don’t know what ur getting all mad about I agree with u, calm ur tits dude..

          • Keshav Bhat

            Thank you.

          • BradyAlucard[sillibk]

            This “blackout” is more of a boycott, which has actually changed something in the past, in regards to history. If there are enough people in the movement (in which I don’t believe there are, at the moment), then it could work. It will definitely never work if young children give death threats to Bobby Kotick. It didn’t work when quickscopers did it to Vonderhaar, and it won’t work now. I’d personally find it more reasonable that gamers become educated on why so many others take issue with Supply Drops, and go from there.

          • darren

            You used the word history and Call of Duty in the same sentence. I and anyone else with a brain has stopped listening.

          • BradyAlucard[sillibk]

            You’re an idiot if you think that I’m drawing that kind of comparison. Boycotts have worked outside of video games, that’s my point. No need to be a trolling asshole.

          • darren

            That’s what you think. You’re on here all the time, and you think that that makes you important. If you fell of the planet, I’m sorry to say, but CI would carry on. And I highly doubt they would even have a memorial. You know the saying about attracting more flies with honey. You get back, what you put out. So, here’s my thing I’ll say to you, regardless of being banned, hated, liked or otherwise. You are nothing but a keyboard commando, who only stands, to argue with the next guy. You have zero beliefs, zero credibility. All you do is react. No action. You have to wait for someone else to have an opinion, then you can chime in. You and your ilk are a penny a pound. You think you’re hot shit on a silver platter, but your nothing but cold cock on a paper plate. I leave you no argument, because I just ended it. Now, the only thing you could do, is call me names and try to hurt my feelings. And have fun with that.

          • ScOott

            Lol dude I have no idea who u r, where as u, reckon u know enough about me to form an opinion, I never said I wad something on c.i I’m just a normal commenter, I actually love the fact u have some sad people such as ur self who to pay so much attention to one person who comments instead of the Cod news lol.. To think keshav knows a group of people who wants to see me band is amazing!

          • Siftblade

            “I be rude as fuck and instantly i get a reply straight away..dont take it personaly buts it’s the only way to get a reaction out of u..”

            That sounds like something a spoiled 12 year old would do to try to get his parents attention because they feel neglected and want all eyes on them. Get over yourself and stop starting shit just so you can be at the center of it, it’s getting annoying

            Keep in mind this doesn’t mean I agree or disagree with any of the points made on COD here, I just think you’re acting like a little brat and it’s getting old

          • ScOott

            Ur a zombies fan l, multilplayer doesn’t mean anything to u, it doesn’t suprise me that all u can do is sit their and pass judgment instead of wanting to see multilplayer improve..

          • Siftblade

            I want to see MP improve. I wasn’t commenting on that, as I said in my last few lines. I’m commenting on your attitude

          • ScOott

            The way I worded everything, I actually got a whole comment section talking about it, if I have to come across as a dick to get that done then so be it, ur thoughts on me do not bother me nor intrest me, ur opinion on the subject is what I wanted..

          • CoDforever

            ” I’ll continue to post my opinions on how I think, not how you want me to think.”

            Oh my god that was just brutal .. *slowly clapping*

          • BradyAlucard[sillibk]

            The e-Sports argument is not directed towards me, but whatever; I would have an issue with defending e-Sports if it were a logical fallacy, or there’s bad reasoning. I have no idea why it exists, why it continues to exist, how it helps the franchise, or how it helps my $60 purchase. All I know is that its community is the most toxic next to the quickscopers, and it does not benefit me in the slightest unless I watch it. I have the same logic about fake “game sports” as I do about actual sports; I’d rather play it than watch it. Other people can do what they want, just don’t ask me to support it or be sincere when the topic comes up, nor will I ever accept that the developers should even remotely listen to “e-Sports” players. My only issue would only come from it affecting the franchise and/or my experience, and it has in some form, hence my issue (just so everyone knows that I don’t “hate on it” for no reason).

          • CoDforever

            It helps the franchise because it attracts a whole new community and guarantees sustainability the whole year through.And it doesnt help your $60 purchase, just like how a campaign doesnt help people that never play it.

            and your right, I’d rather play competitive cod than watch it.

          • BradyAlucard[sillibk]

            I don’t think I could say that that “helps” the franchise, nor do I think it “guarantees sustainability”, because the casual players have been doing that by paying for overpriced DLC like Season Passes and Supply Drops, whilst the “pros” rake in money and that’s all that they do. Maybe if e-“Sports” actually helped in a grander scope, then it would be more widely accepted, but right now, I think it’s irrelevant to both the franchise in general and to anything news-related.

          • CoDforever

            It does help the franchise because it encourages people to watch all the esports events throughout the year thus the interest for the game is maintained for the entire games lifespan.

            yeah the pros rake in money (obviously, just like YouTubers) but they essentially advertise the game. The whole CWL in general is just paid advertising by Activision and its a smart move on their part to capitalize on a massively growing industry.

            Its not relevant? Obviously its not relevant to you because you dont care about it but more than 230,000+ people watched the cod finals 2 days ago which is almost half of the active player base. COD is a very big game that caters to many audiences. Some people only buy it for zombies and dont care about MP and vice versa. Many things are irrelevant in cod and they all vary depending on who you ask.

          • BradyAlucard[sillibk]

            Except for the fact that a very minute fanbase supports e-Sports in comparison to the casual community. e-Sports do not maintain a game’s lifespan, if we wanted to maintain a game’s lifespan, then DLC can be used for that, instead of something that a huge portion of the fanbase couldn’t care less about. I know that pros rake in money, and I don’t think that they should. These are not real professional sports. Just like how I don’t think that YouTubers should be wealthy because people have to actually work for their incomes, but that’s just my opinion.

            It is definitely irrelevant in the grand scheme of things. It doesn’t help the overall gameplay experience, all it does is rake in ad revenue and pay the incomes of a bunch of toxic, loud mouth narcissists. Other things such as MP and Zombies may be irrelevant to those that, say, play the Campaign, but their POV is fallacious because they are actually part of the franchise, whereas e-Sports is just there. Very little of the current playerbase plays Arena. Why? Because the casuals couldn’t care less, hence my point. Besides business opportunities for Activision (even though I don’t think they make much money in comparison to the things that actually matter [imo]), I personally think e-Sports should go, and that’s just me.

          • CoDforever

            ” Except for the fact that a very minute fanbase supports e-Sports in comparison to the casual community.”

            Well obviously you’ve got to start from somewhere. They are trying to build a competitive community and so far they are exceeding at it. Black ops 2 World Championship finals had 60,000 viewers, while Black ops 3 Season 1 finals had 230,000. League Of Legends or CSGO did not get millions of viewers right when it came out.
            Just imagine how many viewers the black ops 3 championship finals will get.

            ” e-Sports do not maintain a game’s lifespan, if we wanted to maintain a game’s lifespan, then DLC can be used for that”

            Probably the stupidest thing I have ever read. If you were a smart company, you would look for EVERY opportunity that would increase overall interest in the game. DLC only caters to the people already playing the game while esports bring a whole other community into COD.

            This is just one example of people coming to cod from other games just because they watched the bo3 season 1 playoffs : https://www.reddit.com/r/CoDCompetitive/comments/4di05h/counterstrikeplayer_checking_in_where_do_i_start/

            And if DLC maps are put into esports, then competitive players would also be forced to buy DLC thus bringing even more DLC sales. During AW, many competitive players bought dlc JUST because they were implemented in the esports ruleset.

            “instead of something that a huge portion of the fanbase couldn’t care less about.

            A huge portion of the fanbase couldnt care less about Free Run, Dead ops, zombies or even campaign. But guess what? They still put it in the fucking game. eSports is just a part of the game as those things are. And they spend millions of dollars doing so. What YOU think is relevant in your copy of cod is different than everyone else.

            ” I know that pros rake in money, and I don’t think that they should.”

            I dont think lotteries, contests or tournaments of any kind other than sports should offer money either. But guess what? They fucking do. I also think actors get extremely overpaid but I dont cry about. They found a way of making a reliable income by being good at something and that opportunity is available to everyone.

            “It is definitely irrelevant in the grand scheme of things. It doesn’t help the overall gameplay experience, all it does is rake in ad revenue and pay the incomes of a bunch of toxic, loud mouth narcissists.”

            Its fucking COD. Half of the whole playerbase is toxic. Actually half of the gaming industry are terrible people. That trait is not exclusive to cod pros. And I have only seen unprofessional behaviour form pros back when competitive COD wasnt as big as it is now. I dont even know why I have to say that, unprofessional behaviour exists everywhere in every sport and every esport.

            If over 230,000+ people watched the finals then I dont know how it is irrelevant. Its proof that an esports scene is there and that it is exponentially growing. Trying to capitalize on it now before it eventually goes big is an extremely smart decision by Activision.

            “Very little of the current playerbase plays Arena. Why? Because the casuals couldn’t care less, hence my point.”

            1) How do you know how many people are playing arena?

            2) Not many play Arena because it is a terrible playlist. The wait time in between games is extremely long and with the added Ban/Protect phase, its almost a 20 minute delay between matches. Myself and many others dont play it because of that reason alone.

            3) League play was the best competitive playlist we’ve ever gotten, and it showed. League play was the 4th most played game mode right behind Team Deathmatch, Domination and Search and Destroy.

          • BradyAlucard[sillibk]

            “Well obviously you’ve got to start from somewhere.”

            So you are seriously okay with Activision alienating two different fanbases? e-Sports doesn’t work for casual games that started casual and didn’t always have it incorporated, hence why it’s such a problem for me in Call of Duty. Casual players couldn’t care less about e-Sports, and they never will.

            “They are trying to build a competitive community and so far they are exceeding at it.”

            Success in regards to the business and profiting side of things are debatable; Activision has always kept acquiring organizations such as UMG and MLG, and let’s not forget all of the MLG-funded million-dollar prize pools. No, e-Sports only exist because, like Supply Drops, Activision wants Counter-Strike money.

            “Black ops 2 World Championship finals had 60,000 viewers, while Black
            ops 3 Season 1 finals had 230,000. League Of Legends or CSGO did not get
            millions of viewers right when it came out.
            Just imagine how many viewers the black ops 3 championship finals will get.”

            I’m pretty sure that you have incorrect facts, unless you can bring forth hard evidence (not saying that I have the facts, either); in regards to those other games, CoD isn’t even close, and [subjectively] I’ve heard that e-Sports have actually been dying since Black Ops 2. It has not gotten bigger, it’s been in a declining spiral since then, and Arena in Black Ops 3 is pretty much dead. Viewership on MLG is not good enough evidence to determine that e-Sports is thriving and not going anywhere anytime soon. I’m sure that there are far more things that can be factored. Even if it’s true that the viewer count during the “championships” will be “HUGE!”, that still doesn’t mean that more than under 5% of the franchise’s players watch and support CoD e-Sports. Yeah, that’s a great business practice in order to have more gamers playing the franchise! It’s common sense that those who are playing Counter-Strike and other big e-Sports couldn’t care less about CoD, so trying to cater to them is ridiculous.

            “Probably the stupidest thing I have ever read.”

            I find supporting e-Sports to be the stupidest thing, in my opinion. It depends on your perspective. I’ll attempt help my point further.

            “If you were a smart company, you would look for EVERY opportunity that would increase overall interest in the game.”

            And e-Sports does not do that. “Our franchise is declining in annual sales year-by-year. What should we do? I know! Let’s introduce e-Sports!” Stupid. If that’s really the stupidest thing you’ve ever heard, then I’m not amused, because does DLC catering to the already-existing playerbase NOT introduce interest into the game in some way? It’s common sense, and it’s not like more people that are buying the game (in which the game ALWAYS charts in the top 10 in NPD) aren’t buying the DLC. If your ‘evidence’ in favor of e-Sport’s growth is live stream viewership, then there aren’t very many gamers coming to the franchise, now, is there? My point was that it’s not e-Sports that’s going to bring more interest, because those who play other games either couldn’t care less about this franchise, despite that person from Reddit, or left to play those games because of the decline of CoD’s substance.

            “And if DLC maps are put into esports, then competitive players would also be forced to buy DLC thus bringing even more DLC sales”

            Then that just means that more maps have to cater to e-Sports, and that’s not an option, as far as I’m concerned [subjectively]. So, even though you think what I said was stupid (and having a terrible reason why), then that must mean that you agree with my point and what I said wasn’t “stupid”? How do you generate more interest into a game? By introducing more incentives to play it, such as x2 events, not by dragging said game away from its roots. Now THAT is what I think the definition of “stupid” is. The logic that I had was that Activision caters to the current playerbase in order to appease them and keep them playing. e-Sports only does that to those that are invested into it, not the game in general. How does watching e-Sports or playing Arena keep us invested into the game, especially since Arena isn’t even populated?

            “A huge portion of the fanbase couldnt care less about Free Run, Dead
            ops, zombies or even campaign. But guess what? They still put it in the
            fucking game.”

            Are you serious? If you seriously don’t think that sizeable portions of the fanbase play those modes (it’s a fact that there are fans for both Campaign and Zombies that only pay $60 for CoD in order to play THOSE fucking modes), then you would be deluded, and those modes are standard and don’t have an alienated, split fanbase like e-Sports does. Free Run is a welcomed feature to add unto the Multiplayer and make the players get used to the movement, so what the fuck does that have to do with anything? I’m okay with adding more features to the game, but e-Sports is a completely different ball game in comparison. SHOULD we keep a competitive mode just so that those who want to play that way can do so? That’s a grey area, because even though I’m in favor of having more options, does it have to be in favor of a minute fanbase instead of using a console’s hardware for something else, such as more maps? I didn’t even think about that; now I’m even more confident in my opinion.

            ” eSports is just a part of the game as those things are. What YOU think
            is relevant in your copy of cod is different than what everyone else
            thinks.”

            WHAT?! Nobody even plays Arena. Do you have the statistics? Last time I checked, barely anyone plays even Free-for-All, so how is it part of the game? Do you understand the opportunities in content that can come for the vast majority of the playerbase if a competitive mode isn’t introduced in future games? Would we not have a better game?

            “Its fucking COD. Half of the whole playerbase is toxic. Actually half of the gaming industry are terrible people.”

            You don’t know that it’s half. Seriously, the franchise rakes in over $1 billion annually, so do you really think that it’s half of us that are toxic? Whatever you see in regards to the non e-Sports or sniping community aren’t near the level of what you see from those communities. Again, it’s not even a debate, and saying that every other thing in existence has unprofessionalism doesn’t help your case in the slightest, nor does it excuse the behavior. Sorry, I don’t want these assholes making more money than the average human being. We can disagree all we want about e-Sports, but I definitely agree with you in regards to entertainment as a whole; everybody in it is overpaid and they don’t deserve it, and it sucks. Don’t act like it’s not important and doesn’t help my concern even a slight bit.

            “If over 230,000+ people watched the finals then I dont know how it is
            irrelevant. Its proof that an esports scene is there and that it is
            exponentially growing. Trying to capitalize on it now before it
            eventually goes big is an extremely smart decision by Activision.”

            How do you know that it’s growing and not declining? No, seriously, I’m interested in hard evidence that it’s constantly growing and not declining in even the least bit. It’s a smart decision in regards to capitalizing on it before it’s vastly successful like other games, yes, but it’s stupid if it’s just going to die in the coming years or months. Don’t count on me to support it.

            1. “How do you know how many people are playing arena?”

            How do YOU know that there are enough players to keep it in future games? Who do you know that plays Arena? I’m getting my logic from League Play. During Black Ops 2’s lifecycle, it wasn’t nearly as populated as public modes, and that’s going by subjective personal experience.

            2. “Not many play Arena because it is a terrible playlist. The wait time in
            between games is extremely long and with the added Ban/Protect phase,
            its almost a 20 minute delay between matches. Myself and many others
            dont play it because of that reason alone.”

            I’m sorry. I’m being serious. I don’t like the fact that you support it and you aren’t getting what you wanted, but that’s probably not the reason why nobody plays it, and does that mean that you technically agree with me, perhaps again? What are you attempting to argue, here?

            3. “League play was the best competitive playlist we’ve ever gotten, and it
            showed. League play was the 4th most played game mode right behind Team
            Deathmatch, Domination and Search and Destroy.”

            Arena is arguably better. I don’t play the modes, but I’m sure that, with the added features, that one could argue that Arena is better than League Play. They’re both definitely way better than Ranked Play. And, no, League Play was NOT the 4th most played game mode because, during Black Ops 2’s lifecycle, I pretty much ALWAYS saw under 10,000 players online (4-6,000 to be exact, in comparison to 70,000 in TDM), so I don’t know what you’re talking about. I’m pretty sure that that statistic is completely wrong.

          • CoDforever

            ” So you are seriously okay with Activision alienating two different fanbases? e-Sports doesn’t work for casual games that started casual and didn’t always have it incorporated, hence why it’s such a problem for me in Call of Duty. Casual players couldn’t care less about e-Sports, and they never will.”

            You dont even speak for the whole casual community so stop pretending like you represent all of them. Just because casuals dont play competitive doesnt mean they dont like watching it either. Many casuals enjoy watching it and accept it for what it is. How do I know this? Because 230,000 watched the finals, and we sure as hell dont have 230,000 players that actively play competitive. Add in the fact that most big youtubers who have never played competitive cod in their life also enjoyed watching competitive events before, such as Chris Smoove.

            And I dont see how it is alienating the fanbase, its basically just a moshpit of game modes that are already played by casuals with slightly tweaked settings. Hardcore modes are alienating the total cod population more than competitive is. Alienating isnt even the right word.

            ” Success in regards to the business and profiting side of things are debatable; Activision has always kept acquiring organizations such as UMG and MLG, and let’s not forget all of the MLG-funded million-dollar prize pools. No, e-Sports only exist because, like Supply Drops, Activision wants Counter-Strike money.:

            MLG wouldnt fund million dollar prize pools if they didnt end up with a profit. By the way, the highest prize pool MLG has ever had for cod was 200,000, nowhere near a million. And the highest UMG has ever had was like, 20k.

            ” I’m pretty sure that you have incorrect facts, unless you can bring forth hard evidence (not saying that I have the facts, either); in regards to those other games, CoD isn’t even close, and [subjectively] I’ve heard that e-Sports have actually been dying since Black Ops 2. It has not gotten bigger, it’s been in a declining spiral since then, and Arena in Black Ops 3 is pretty much dead.”

            I watched the COD championship 2013 finals, it was my first time watching competitive cod and It was averaging 50-60k viewers with the absolute peak at 100k (for a brief moment). It was posted on reddit, but all the old cod subreddits got merged and that post is not viewable anymore. But literally just read the recent article on charlieintel about how the Season 1 finals were one of the most watched cod events.

            Ofcourse cod numbers are nowhere near the other major esports. The only games bigger than it right now are CSGo, LoL and hearthstone. CS has been played competitively since 1998 while LoL – 2009. Those game have had way more time to grow than the esports side of cod, which basically started in 2013.

            esports has been dying since Bo2? Since when? There has only been one time in CODesports where the viewership declined, and ill get into that in a bit. The peak viewership of cod events has increased every year with bo3 season 1 finals being the most watched or second most watched event and its not even the championship. Now, the one time the esports scene has declined is halfway through AW where everyone was sick and tired of that horseshit of a game. The game was just terrible in general and nobody would endure that even if they liked competitive. I am a huge cod competitive fan and the AW season was the only time I never watched ANY event. Even though I hated ghosts too, it was ok for comp so it was enjoyable. Now the viewership is right back with bo3 and is seemingly going to go to new heights.

            And honestly, competitive can be seen as just trying to split up the tryhards from the casual community rather than them being forced together; thats how its helping out the franchise. I had a 2.7 kdr and I got sick and tired of slaying noobs but I still liked the game. I switched over to competitive and I dont regret it at all. Theres more satisfaction in destroying a tryhard competitive team than there is just slaying noobs that dont have any thumbs.

            ” It’s common sense that those who are playing Counter-Strike and other big e-Sports couldn’t care less about CoD”

            Oh how wrong you are. With the CWL, MAJOR esports organizations have come into cod from LoL and CSGo: TSM, Cloud9, H2k and CLG just to name a few. TSM and Cloud9 are huge and their popularity in LoL can be rivaled by only OpTic or FaZe.

            “And e-Sports does not do that. “Our franchise is declining in annual sales year-by-year. What should we do? I know! Let’s introduce e-Sports!” Stupid. If that’s really the stupidest thing you’ve ever heard, then I’m not amused, because does DLC catering to the already-existing playerbase NOT introduce interest into the game in some way? It’s common sense, and it’s not like more people that are buying the game (in which the game ALWAYS charts in the top 10 in NPD) aren’t buying the DLC. If your ‘evidence’ in favor of e-Sport’s growth is live stream viewership, then there aren’t very many gamers coming to the franchise, now, is there? My point was that it’s not e-Sports that’s going to bring more interest, because those who play other games either couldn’t care less about this franchise, despite that person from Reddit, or left to play those games because of the decline of CoD’s substance.”

            You see, thats where your wrong. Building a pro cod scene for Activision is extremely smart. Casual players are constantly leaving the franchise for their own reasons, while competitive players are OBLIGED to buy every cod going forward no matter how bad the games are. Activision is looking at the bigger picture here. Those are just one of the perks of having a competitive scene. If they put in micro DLC like Optic, faze etc calling cards and promised to the put in a % of that into COD championship prize pool, than every competitive fan would buy them in a heartbeat. Theres a very profitable market here, and activision isnt blind. Their monopolization of the cod competitive scene has only just began. They could give a shit if the game is selling lower copies than before as long as its making up for it in total revenue. Which it isnt might I add, Bo3 has already sold more than several of the older cod’s.

            “Then that just means that more maps have to cater to e-Sports, and that’s not an option, as far as I’m concerned [subjectively]. So, even though you think what I said was stupid (and having a terrible reason why), then that must mean that you agree with my point and what I said wasn’t “stupid”? How do you generate more interest into a game? By introducing more incentives to play it, such as x2 events, not by dragging said game away from its roots. Now THAT is what I think the definition of “stupid” is. The logic that I had was that Activision caters to the current playerbase in order to appease them and keep them playing. e-Sports only does that to those that are invested into it, not the game in general. How does watching e-Sports or playing Arena keep us invested into the game, especially since Arena isn’t even populated?”

            Your failing like to realize that the competitive COD community DID not start as competitive fans. 90% of us used to be just like you. We were casual players turned competitive. You know what turned us competitive? COD events. Watching the game being played at a highly competitive level with multiple strategies being used, communication being key and where winning the game is everything showed us that there is more to this game than just mindlessly shooting noobs. The only reason for the growth of competitive cod IS the events, the million dollar tourneys, league play etc (not arena) so its a fine investment I must say.

            “By introducing more incentives to play it” Exactly. Competitive does exactly that. I like to meetup with my friends and play a few GB’s where we’re playing for the win and we are in the same skill level.Where the matches get intense and we barely clutch it out. These are the reason why I keep playing. We like to play the game the way we want to, not the way you want us to. That is literally the whole main appeal of cod in the first place.

            “You don’t know that it’s half. Seriously, the franchise rakes in over $1 billion annually, so do you really think that it’s half of us that are toxic? Whatever you see in regards to the non e-Sports or sniping community aren’t near the level of what you see from those communities. Again, it’s not even a debate, and saying that every other thing in existence has unprofessionalism doesn’t help your case in the slightest, nor does it excuse the behavior. Sorry, I don’t want these assholes making more money than the average human being. We can disagree all we want about e-Sports, but I definitely agree with you in regards to entertainment as a whole; everybody in it is overpaid and they don’t deserve it, and it sucks. Don’t act like it’s not important and doesn’t help my concern even a slight bit.”

            What i said about toxic pro players was worded terribly. Let me rephrase:

            Just because I support the competitive scene does not mean I support those toxic players. Most of the players in the videos are amateurs nobody has ever heard about. You dont see big professional org’s like Optic, Faze or Nv acting like that. And those are org’s that everyone supports and watches in the cod competitive community. And more and more professional orgs have made their way into the Call of Duty esports scene. Those are the players that are adored by comp. Not that randomn screaming raging fat guy that everybody hates.

            “Are you serious? If you seriously don’t think that sizeable portions of the fanbase play those modes (it’s a fact that there are fans for both Campaign and Zombies that only pay $60 for CoD in order to play THOSE fucking modes), then you would be deluded, and those modes are standard and don’t have an alienated, split fanbase like e-Sports does. Free Run is a welcomed feature to add unto the Multiplayer and make the players get used to the movement, so what the fuck does that have to do with anything? I’m okay with adding more features to the game, but e-Sports is a completely different ball game in comparison. SHOULD we keep a competitive mode just so that those who want to play that way can do so? That’s a grey area, because even though I’m in favor of having more options, does it have to be in favor of a minute fanbase instead of using a console’s hardware for something else, such as more maps? I didn’t even think about that; now I’m even more confident in my opinion.”

            esports would exist in COD even if Activision did not support it. Why are you pretending like esports is some completely different game that Activision puts aside majority of their budget on? We use the same maps, weapons, perks, scorestreaks that are already in the casual MP aspect of the game. Yeah, zombies has a sizeable community but guess that? It didnt always start out like that. Same analogy can be used to describe cod esports. You cant just throw a couple million dollars at esports and expect millions of viewers right away, you have to build a competitive community first, and thats exactly what ATVI is doing. And there is no alienation between casual and competitive; you can freely switch between the two. Play public matches when you just wanna relax and play competitive when you feel like try harding and testing your skill against the world. Thats what I do and everyone that has ever played competitive before. Its the same as playing different game modes depending on what you feeling like play at the time.

            “WHAT?! Nobody even plays Arena. Do you have the statistics? Last time I checked, barely anyone plays even Free-for-All, so how is it part of the game? Do you understand the opportunities in content that can come for the vast majority of the playerbase if a competitive mode isn’t introduced in future games? Would we not have a better game?”

            Holy shit, the number of people that play arena is not the same as the number of people that enjoy cod esports. Scrims, GB’s, prize pools, viewerships are sensible metrics of the overall interest in esports, not people that play a shitty playlist called Arena. I love competitive and I am absolutely disgusted by Arena mode. I have only played it once at launch and have never played since. But does that automatically make me not like competitive? Hell no. Arena players is a terrible metric that 90% of competitive fans dont even touch.

            Even on the official cod competitive subreddit, there is always an upvoted thread every day talking about how shit Arena is. Heres one:

            https://www.reddit.com/r/CoDCompetitive/comments/3zrett/arena_is_sad/

            “How do you know that it’s growing and not declining? No, seriously, I’m interested in hard evidence that it’s constantly growing and not declining in even the least bit. It’s a smart decision in regards to capitalizing on it before it’s vastly successful like other games, yes, but it’s stupid if it’s just going to die in the coming years or months. Don’t count on me to support it.”

            Read the recent article on this website. The season 1 playoffs were one of the most watched cod esports events in history. 230,000 I believe is an absolute peak in viewership for cod. The previous record was 205,000 at MLG columbus 2014.

            https://www.reddit.com/r/CoDCompetitive/comments/2nx2ww/6_things_we_learned_from_mlg_columbus/

            Read 6) on that post. It says “This event smashed the previous record of concurrent viewers during a live event with over 205,000 viewers.”

            “How do YOU know that there are enough players to keep it in future games? Who do you know that plays Arena? I’m getting my logic from League Play. During Black Ops 2’s lifecycle, it wasn’t nearly as populated as public modes, and that’s going by subjective personal experience.”

            Because its still played by more than half of the other game modes and the fact that it is just a moshpit playlist containing game modes that the casual community already plays anyway.

            “I’m sorry. I’m being serious. I don’t like the fact that you support it and you aren’t getting what you wanted, but that’s probably not the reason why nobody plays it, and does that mean that you technically agree with me, perhaps again? What are you attempting to argue, here?”

            It is the reason why nobody plays it. its an absolute broken mess from start to finish. They royally fucked up this time and fixing it would require them to completely redo the playlist; which they clearly arent going to do.

            “Arena is arguably better.” Ofcourse you would say that just because it supports your opinion that Arena is still somehow an accurate measure of how many people like competitive cod. Since we both know why you said that we also know that you have probably never played Arena in your life. Well im here to tell you why its absolutely terrible especially compared to League Play.

            1) Arena matchmaking is completely broken and takes ages to connect to others players for some other reason as this issue did not occur in League Play at all. The issue has been found as bug in the games code, as treyarch tried to patch it very recently

            2) The ban/protect system is a HUGE turnoff. Not only does it take ages to finish but if your teammate leaves the game during this system then you would still have to sit through all of it knowing your going to lose. This added in with broken matchmaking makes the time between games roughly 20 minutes on average. Compared to bo2 league play which was around 2-3 minutes.

            3) The ranking system is terrible. League play calculated your wins, losses, KD etc and gave you a skill rating based on that. While Arena is only based on winning the game. Meaning that if you DDOS the whole enemy team in quitting the game (which happens a lot), you will be the best rank.

            4) There is no team ranking like League Play, meaning that you and your friend cannot have a rank that represents your teams overall skill level. This isnt that bad, but it makes playing with your friends a little less worth it.

            5) The god awful ruleset. Normally, things like Trip mines, shock charges and other annoying things would be banned but for some reason they arent. The GB setting have these things banned though, so thats why everyone would rather play GB.

            6) The map voting system. In League Play, the lobby would get forced into a randomn map whether it would be Hardpoint, CTF, SnD etc but now theres map voting, so everyone always votes for SnD. Now its just search and destroy 24/7 which gets incredibly boring very fast.

            They have taken away more from Arena than they have added to it.

            “And, no, League Play was NOT the 4th most played game mode because, during Black Ops 2’s lifecycle, I pretty much ALWAYS saw under 10,000 players online (4-6,000 to be exact, in comparison to 70,000 in TDM), so I don’t know what you’re talking about. I’m pretty sure that that statistic is completely wrong.”

            Well yeah, the drop off in players between the first played game mode and the 2nd most played game mode is huge, but that doesnt change the fact that it was still technically the 4th most played game mode

            Also League play averaged 15-20k players in its prime

            I spent almost 2 hours on this post, I think we need to stop quoting paragraphs

          • BradyAlucard[sillibk]

            “You dont even speak for the whole casual community so stop pretending
            like you represent all of them. Just because casuals dont play
            competitive doesnt mean they dont like watching it either”

            And who represents the casual community? You? I didn’t even imply that, so I have no idea where you’re coming from, so stop jumping to conclusions, and stop telling me what to do.

            “And I dont see how it is alienating the fanbase, its basically just a
            moshpit of game modes that are already played by casuals with slightly
            tweaked settings. Hardcore modes are alienating the total cod population
            more than competitive is. Alienating isnt even the right word.”

            Obviously you don’t understand what I meant. It alienates the fanbases. The communities. If we have to differentiate other communities and labeling them as the “competitive”, “sniper”, or “casual” communities instead of the “Call of Duty community”, then there’s an obvious problem. You can call it whatever you want; alienating, splitting, ruining, whatever.

            “MLG wouldnt fund million dollar prize pools if they didnt end up with a
            profit. By the way, the highest prize pool MLG has ever had for cod was
            200,000, nowhere near a million. And the highest UMG has ever had was
            like, 20k.”

            I’ve always gotten mixed up with this shit, so I don’t know what to believe. I’ve heard that the championship prize pool of $1 million came from MLG, Activision, Microsoft, etc. People were all over the place, with what I’ve been arguing with for the past few years. I never said that UMG had million dollar prize pools though, I merely stated that it was acquired, and it was, for millions. Activision has invested tens if not hundreds of millions into the competitive scene. All that money that could have been potentially put into dedicated servers or other features is now gone, thanks to your precious e-Sports. There would be a lot that they’d have to make back. At least they’re crowdfunding.

            “Ofcourse cod numbers are nowhere near the other major esports. The only
            games bigger than it right now are CSGo, LoL and hearthstone. CS has
            been played competitively since 1998 while LoL – 2009. Those game have
            had way more time to grow than the esports side of cod, which basically
            started in 2013.”

            Nah, I wouldn’t say “basically”, because competitive pre-Black Ops 2 was more of a small side-feature with Game Battles, so it’s technically been since 2007, if you want to get into the cherrypicking specifics, but it didn’t really start until Black Ops 1. In regards to money-wise, yeah, it’s roughly the MW3/Black Ops 2 “era”.

            “esports has been dying since Bo2? Since when? There has only been one
            time in CODesports where the viewership declined, and ill get into that
            in a bit. The peak viewership of cod events has increased every year
            with bo3 season 1 finals being the most watched or second most watched
            event and its not even the championship.”

            Since when has a live stream viewership been an indicator of success? Is that the only evidence that competitive can give to argue that it’s constantly growing? I don’t believe it, there’s got to be more to it. Way more. If we’re talking only about live stream viewerships and it’s literally the only indicator,then it’s not bad, but I’m sure the community can indicate why competitive CoD is dying. But I’m not sure, subjectively I think the hosts of The Podcast Show put it well; that the main thing that has gotten bigger about it is the funding and the organization around it, that its peak was Black Ops 2 in raw numbers, and it has gone down in raw numbers since then. I’m not sure if that’s a fact or not, but I can see it (it’s episode 55 with xJawz at around 40 minutes in). I can’t say for sure, I wonder what everyone else thinks?

            “Now, the one time the esports scene has declined is halfway through AW
            where everyone was sick and tired of that horseshit of a game. The game
            was just terrible in general and nobody would endure that even if they
            liked competitive. I am a huge cod competitive fan and the AW season was
            the only time I never watched ANY event.”

            That’s why e-Sports is declining, it’s because CoD has had games that hte consumers didn’t like and they’re screwing around with the fundamentals. It’s a tiny e-Sport, at this point, and if this all continues, then it’s just going to keep declining. I think I’d much rather see something that I don’t feel belongs to die off rather than it to stay and turn CoD into something that it’s not and never was in the first place.

            “And honestly, competitive can be seen as just trying to split up the
            tryhards from the casual community rather than them being forced
            together; thats how its helping out the franchise”

            My problem is that it was wrong that CoD developers have screwed with public matches because of it via things like skill-based matchmaking among other things, hence why I don’t believe that it splits anything up at all, in that regard, but it definitely splits up the overall community in-game and on the internet. It’s funny, because skill being a factor even at all puts the tryhards and casuals together, so I don’t see the point.

            “I had a 2.7 kdr and I got sick and tired of slaying noobs but I still
            liked the game. I switched over to competitive and I dont regret it at
            all. Theres more satisfaction in destroying a tryhard competitive team
            than there is just slaying noobs that dont have any thumbs.”

            You can do whatever you want with your $60/80/100+. All I know is that many players like us are “veterans” and have supported the franchise for the past decade (give or take) by spending hundreds if not thousands on the games. I happen to have multiple copies of all CoD games of the past decade (or so) other than Ghosts and Advanced Warfare. But I digress. I used to be like everyone else in regards to caring about how good I am at the game, and was even a quickscoper during MW2. Now I couldn’t care less about sniping (in fact I want the sniping community to be gone and all related YouTube channels to never exist), and I even argue that “skill” isn’t even a factor in a game like CoD, so saying that I don’t like the game “because I suck” in a casual game doesn’t make sense to me, anymore. Point is, is that I don’t think it matters. I don’t want the game to be easy, but I don’t want to have bad players on my team and average/solid enemies, either, so where does the “splitting” come in? I don’t think facing tryhards is fun, but that’s just me.

            “Oh how wrong you are. With the CWL, MAJOR esports organizations have
            come into cod from LoL and CSGo: TSM, Cloud9, H2k and CLG just to name a
            few. TSM and Cloud9 are huge and their popularity in LoL can be rivaled
            by only OpTic or FaZe.”

            That furthers my point from earlier. The raw numbers are declining, but there are more resources being put into organizations and such, and I don’t see how adding those organizations to CoD would generate interest from the other games.

            “You see, thats where your wrong. Building a pro cod scene for Activision is extremely smart.”

            It really depends, because building a competitive scene wouldn’t be very clever if it doesn’t have the numbers. Why attempt to generate interest into it if nobody even plays their in-game playlist? If competitive CoD really is dying in regards to raw numbers (and I don’t think “raw numbers” means “live stream viewership”), then it’s a stupid investment, and the community (I’m not sure about the business) would be better off with having more dedicated servers, or more features, hell, even more marketing. I’d love to not care and play ranked Combat Training again, hell, I wanted prestiging to it in Black Ops 1. That was a cool feature, and shit like Arena, in which you said isn’t even good, mind you; restricts features like that for happening (and yes I’m preparing myself for the trolls telling me that I’m a noob because I think the actual game isn’t a pleasant experience). I think they’d generate more profit if they did these things.

            “Watching the game being played at a highly competitive level with
            multiple strategies being used, communication being key and where
            winning the game is everything showed us that there is more to this game
            than just mindlessly shooting noobs”

            That is my EXACT (subjective) reason why I think e-Sports should just die. CoD IS about just mindlessly shooting noobs! There’s no option of trying to change that. Halo is a competitive game and e-Sports works because of that, whereas CoD has NEVER been about it, so trying to force it isn’t going to work in the long run, which is another one of the reasons why it could be dying. We’re just arguing over personal preference, at this point. I’m not asking you to agree, I’m just being honest with my point of view. And I’m now mainly interested in seeing objectively where you got the statistic of the “90% of us used to be like you” comment, because I wouldn’t believe that for a second.

            “Competitive does exactly that.” I still think that DLC or x2 XP is more effective for that.

            “I like to meetup with my friends and play
            a few GB’s where we’re playing for the win and we are in the same skill
            level.Where the matches get intense and we barely clutch it out.” And not everybody wants to do this. I don’t want to play like that, because I personally don’t think it’s fun.

            “These
            are the reason why I keep playing. We like to play the game the way we
            want to, not the way you want us to. That is literally the whole main
            appeal of cod in the first place.” I never wanted you to play the way that I want you to because I think that there is a set boundary of respect, and I wouldn’t want to play the way that you’d want me to, either, especially in public matches. I don’t want to be forced to like e-Sports, or be forced to play against players who are the same skill level as me. That’s not Call of Duty to me, and that’s not the way that I want to play my online games.

            “What i said about toxic pro players was worded terribly. Let me rephrase”

            I very much so appreciate the further elaboration, but I don’t think
            that I’ve said what I wanted to say about the competitive community,
            either.

            “Just because I support the competitive scene does not mean I support those toxic players.”

            In my opinion, if you’re going to support something, then you’re accepting that you’re supporting it knowing that those players exist. I definitely don’t think that you’re like them, but it’s not just those people that I’m talking about.

            ” Most of the players in the videos are amateurs nobody has ever heard
            about. You dont see big professional org’s like Optic, Faze or Nv acting
            like that. And those are org’s that everyone supports and watches in
            the cod competitive community. And more and more professional orgs have
            made their way into the Call of Duty esports scene. Those are the
            players that are adored by comp. Not that randomn screaming raging fat
            guy that everybody hates.”

            It’s not just about the horribly toxic screamers and disrespectful punks; I don’t like the behavior of the competitive community in-general. I think that that toxicity translates to more than the “screamers”. If it were just about that minute portion of the competitive community, then it’d be a non-issue. I don’t think that I could explain it well, and I don’t think that it’s worth explaining, because since you’re more invested into it, you haven’t had the experience that I’ve had with the competitive community on social media, and I’m talking about even the more popular ones. All you need to know is that I don’t like the way they act and their logic for everything. I’d say that Drama Alert is a pretty alright indicator of my concern. But yeah, that minute crowd (I’ve seen quite a few nobodies on Twitter and they’re narcissistic assholes, believe me) are just awful.

            “esports would exist in COD even if Activision did not support it.”

            Maybe, but it wouldn’t be so heavily integrated if they didn’t. It’d just be a side community ordeal again, in which I personally think that that’s how it should be.

            “Why are you pretending like esports is some completely different game that Activision puts aside majority of their budget on?”

            Because they put a sizeable amount of a budget into it. Again, tens if not hundreds of millions. To put it into perspective, map packs cost *maybe* a couple million each. Plus, it is pretty much a completely different online experience from the regular experience, so I’d say that they’re both the case, to a certain extent.

            “We use the same maps, weapons, perks, scorestreaks that are already in the casual MP aspect of the game”

            With different rules and restrictions. I personally think that it’s pretty different, and it wouldn’t be its own playlist if it wasn’t.

            “Yeah, zombies has a sizeable community but guess that? It didnt always
            start out like that. Same analogy can be used to describe cod esports.”

            Except for the fact that Zombies were an instant hit. I still think it’s apples and oranges.

            “You cant just throw a couple million dollars at esports and expect
            millions of viewers right away, you have to build a competitive
            community first, and thats exactly what ATVI is doing.”

            Nope, Activision is just wasting tens of millions of dedicated servers and marketing money to do it.

            “And there is no alienation between casual and competitive; you can freely switch between the two.”

            In regards to the communities being split-up, yes, there is an alienation of sorts. And I’m not a fan of integrating e-Sports in the game like that, but that’s just me.

            “Arena players is a terrible metric that 90% of competitive fans dont even touch.”

            Then what is it that you’re trying to say? What exactly are “freely switching” if nobody likes Arena? I wouldn’t want you to misinterpret my comment in case of poor wording on my part; if nobody plays Arena, then there’s no way of playing competitive, so what’s the point, here? Why is it still in the game? It’d be nice if they replaced it with a new feature.

            “Read the recent article on this website. The season 1 playoffs were one
            of the most watched cod esports events in history. 230,000 I believe is
            an absolute peak in viewership for cod. The previous record was 205,000
            at MLG columbus 2014.”

            Yeah, I didn’t ignore that, but I still don’t think that viewership is as much of an indicator of growth as those that actually play it, but I won’t act like I’m not impressed with those numbers. If the point of e-Sports is to “generate interest”, if nobody’s playing Arena, then what are they playing? Hence why the “raw numbers” have gone down, and why it has declined since Black Ops 1. Players aren’t as interested into playing it as they used to be. That’s all that I wanted to argue.

            “Because its still played by more than half of the other game modes and
            the fact that it is just a moshpit playlist containing game modes that
            the casual community already plays anyway.”

            And how do you know that it’s played more than half of the other game modes? There’s no indicator for either side, so where are you getting these statistics from?

            “Ofcourse you would say that just because it supports your opinion that
            Arena is still somehow an accurate measure of how many people like
            competitive cod. Since we both know why you said that we also know that
            you have probably never played Arena in your life. Well im here to tell
            you why its absolutely terrible especially compared to League Play.”

            My opinion of Arena being *some sort of* indication of the *decline* of competitive CoD could also be said about you only use viewership numbers because it suits your narrative, as well, but that’s not even what I was trying to say, and I don’t do it to suit my narrative. Let me rephrase; from things like what they showed in the Arena trailer pre-launch, it would make me think that it’s better than League Play just drawing from that. And I admit that I didn’t know about those Arena issues, and don’t give a fuck about competitive, so I will probably never play Arena, but you said that you only played it once, so don’t you sort of have as little of experience as I do? Anyway, yeah, that’s news to me, I didn’t know about its issues.

            “Well yeah, the drop off in players between the first played game mode
            and the 2nd most played game mode is huge, but that doesnt change the
            fact that it was still technically the 4th most played game mode

            Also League play averaged 15-20k players in its prime”

            Again, where are the statistics? I was talking about it’s prime, too, and I’m not saying that you’re wrong, I’m genuinely asking where you’re coming from.

          • CoDforever

            I never said I represented the entire casual community. But to say that EVERY singe casual player despises cod esports is absurd. Im pretty sure a majority of them are fine with esports, the only people that hate it are online vocal minorities like you that falsely believe each of cods problems being a result of cod esports.

            and what does “casual” even mean exactly? Casual should be a term defined by the consumers usage level, not if they play competitive or not. Just because you are level 1000 but only play Domination does not make you a “casual” player. If we are using the flawed logic of calling every non-competitive player a casual, then many casuals have more play time then competitive players, which makes no sense. They are “public players”, not “casuals”.

            It doesnt alienate anything. Many games have a ranked competitive playlist that uses a completely different ruleset than public matches do. Battlefield, Titanfall, Rainbow 6, CSGo etc

            Let me get this straight, your mad that they spent 43 million acquiring MLG, but its okay for them to spend 5.9 billion on .. candy crush? You also know that they bought MLG for many other reasons than cod, right? Hearthstone (which is one of the biggest competitive games ever), Starcraft, Heroes of the storm, Overwatch etc are all major esports from Activision. They plan to use MLG resources in all of those games, including cod.

            and the 1 million comes from either playstation or xbox. MLG had nothing to do with the first and second cod champs. The highest prize pool they ever had was about 200k for cod. UMG was never acquired by Activision. Its not hard to google these things.

            Activision only began to support the scene in 2012/2013. So yes, COD esports basically started in Black ops 2.

            Of course the livestream viewers for cod esports is an indication of how good the competitive scene is doing. A big part if not the biggest part of COD esports is watching the game. Raw numbers have decreased since Bo2? How so? A BO3 200k event had way more viewers than a 1 million dollar BO2 event, so you tell me if its solely based on the funding or not.

            “That’s why e-Sports is declining, it’s because CoD has had games that hte consumers didn’t like and they’re screwing around with the fundamentals. It’s a tiny e-Sport, at this point, and if this all continues, then it’s just going to keep declining. I think I’d much rather see something that I don’t feel belongs to die off rather than it to stay and turn CoD into something that it’s not and never was in the first place.”

            This comment makes no sense whatsoever, how are we to blame for exo suits? We want COD games like COD4 and Bo2 which surprise surprise the public community wants as well.

            There is absolutely no correlation between SBMM in public games and competitive at all. The competitive community doesn’t want SBMM in pubs as much as you guys don’t. We play pubs when we just wanna screw around and play competitive when we want to go tryhard so why would we also ask for SBMM in pubs? Thats completely on the devs and they have never said its because of competitive so there are many reason why it could have been implemented. Titanfall has SBMM but that game is far from an esport as the Devs have not supported an esports scene at all.

            “You can do whatever you want with your $60/80/100+. All I know is that many players like us are “veterans” and have supported the franchise for the past decade (give or take) by spending hundreds if not thousands on the games. I happen to have multiple copies of all CoD games of the past decade (or so) other than Ghosts and Advanced Warfare. But I digress. I used to be like everyone else in regards to caring about how good I am at the game, and was even a quickscoper during MW2. Now I couldn’t care less about sniping (in fact I want the sniping community to be gone and all related YouTube channels to never exist), and I even argue that “skill” isn’t even a factor in a game like CoD, so saying that I don’t like the game “because I suck” in a casual game doesn’t make sense to me, anymore. Point is, is that I don’t think it matters. I don’t want the game to be easy, but I don’t want to have bad players on my team and average/solid enemies, either, so where does the “splitting” come in? I don’t think facing tryhards is fun, but that’s just me.”

            I have no idea what the point of this paragraph is. You don’t like facing tryhards, thats why you play pubs. Pubs either randomnly puts you with good players or bad players. I have faced good players in every MP game so I don’t see how that has anything do with esports. And there is “skill” in any PvP game. Thats why top competitive teams stay consist over the years. COD is not as random as you make it seem to be. Its not like a player would go 100-0 one game and then 0-56 the next. Anyone that goes 100-0 in cod is most likely a dominant player in general.

            “The raw numbers are declining, but there are more resources being put into organizations and such, and I don’t see how adding those organizations to CoD would generate interest from the other games.”

            Ofcourse they would. And stop saying raw numbers are declining, you have not shown any proof to back up that statement. A competitive scene is entirely based on organizations and their fanbases/popularity. Nobody wants to watch a bunch of players they never heard of.TSM came from LoL and many LoL players watch CoD now JUST because they like TSM from LoL. Pretty basic concept here.

            “CoD IS about just mindlessly shooting noobs!:

            With the right ruleset and balanced teams, it doesn’t have to be.

            “”90% of us used to be like you” comment, because I wouldn’t believe that for a second.”

            You think competitive cod players only began playing cod because of competitive play in the first place or you think that we would leave a game like CSGo or LoL to go to CoD just because they now support esports? Ofcourse we all (or most of us) started as normal cod players, I don’t think why you would think anything else.

            “And not everybody wants to do this. I don’t want to play like that, because I personally don’t think it’s fun.”

            And is anyone forcing you to?

            “I don’t want to be forced to like e-Sports, or be forced to play against players who are the same skill level as me. That’s not Call of Duty to me, and that’s not the way that I want to play my online games.”

            Holy shit. No one is forcing you to play against tryhards. COD has never even been advertised as a game where you will 100% play against noobs every game. Ofcourse you will get in a lobby with good players every once in a while, even in pubs. Thats how all online games work.

            “In my opinion, if you’re going to support something, then you’re accepting that you’re supporting it knowing that those players exist.”

            Probably the most flawed logic I have ever heard. I support FIFA but everybody in the world knows that douchebag and toxic football players exist. Its apart of everyday life.

            “Maybe, but it wouldn’t be so heavily integrated if they didn’t. It’d just be a side community ordeal again, in which I personally think that that’s how it should be.”

            It is still a side thing. The game would be drastically different if it only allowed you to play competitive. Adding in a spectator mode and a moshpit alongside public matches is not heavily integrating esports into the public experience. I don’t know why anyone would think that.

            “Because they put a sizeable amount of a budget into it. Again, tens if not hundreds of millions. To put it into perspective, map packs cost *maybe* a couple million each. Plus, it is pretty much a completely different online experience from the regular experience, so I’d say that they’re both the case, to a certain extent.”

            Hahaha I wish they put in 10’s of millions into it, let alone a 100. They put down 3 million this year and whether or not it came from Sony is unconfirmed. And with all the viewers they’ve gotten so far, I’d say they made back well over their investment.

            “Except for the fact that Zombies were an instant hit. I still think it’s apples and oranges.”

            Well the first year that they supported COD esports was also an instant hit. It quickly became one of the most popular esports at the time and was the biggest FPS esport.

            “Then what is it that you’re trying to say? What exactly are “freely switching” if nobody likes Arena? I wouldn’t want you to misinterpret my comment in case of poor wording on my part; if nobody plays Arena, then there’s no way of playing competitive, so what’s the point, here? Why is it still in the game? It’d be nice if they replaced it with a new feature.”

            Scrims, GB’s, UMG’s, Online Tourneys, 8’s, etc MLG has had way more GB’s in BO3 then they ever had before. Add in these players with the Arena players and you should easily have 15-25% of the active playerbase being competitive players, which is huge considering a couple years ago that was less than 1%.

            “And how do you know that it’s played more than half of the other game modes? There’s no indicator for either side, so where are you getting these statistics from?”

            I was talking about League Play.

            “Again, where are the statistics? I was talking about it’s prime, too, and I’m not saying that you’re wrong, I’m genuinely asking where you’re coming from.”

            Because BO2 used to show you all the players in each playlist and whenever I played League Play it showed more players than every mode except TDM, Domination and Free For all.

          • BradyAlucard[sillibk]

            Yeah… This is pointless, so I’m going to slightly dial it down.

            You said that I think that I represent the CoD community, in which I don’t, which is a stupid accusation, nor did I say that “each” of this franchise’s problems were a result of e-Sports. It’s been a known fact that e-“Sports” can influence things like map design and matchmaking, if not more things. There’s no way that you can say that e-Sports didn’t influence anything with a straight face, because that would be an utter bullshit lie. And they definitely put tens of millions into it, if we were to include organization acquisitions.

            “Ofcourse they would. And stop saying raw numbers are declining, you have
            not shown any proof to back up that statement. A competitive scene is
            entirely based on organizations and their fanbases/popularity”? “Probably the most flawed logic I have ever heard. I support FIFA but
            everybody in the world knows that douchebag and toxic football players
            exist. Its apart of everyday life”? “With the right ruleset and balanced teams, it doesn’t have to be.”? That’s just ignorant. Using the past year as an indicator, raw numbers via Arena and GB’s offer far more evidence than Twitch viewers because those who actually play it offer a bigger backbone to base how much the competitive scene has declined. A huge portion of the e-Sports crowd are toxic, and if you don’t believe that, then you have an even worse bias than I thought. Also, you can’t turn a casual game into a competitive one, and that’s been my point this whole time. CoD was never meant to be played competitively, Zampella laughed at even the thought of it.

            “And is anyone forcing you to?” “Holy shit. No one is forcing you to play against tryhards. COD has never
            even been advertised as a game where you will 100% play against noobs
            every game. Ofcourse you will get in a lobby with good players every
            once in a while, even in pubs. Thats how all online games work.” Have you played Advanced Warfare and Black Ops 3? That’s exactly what Skill-based Matchmaking (or scrub-based matchmaking) is. CoD IS advertised as a game where you shouldn’t take it very serious, hence casual gameplay. Nobody said that they wanted to play against bad players 100% of the time, I’m just tired of having a shitty team yet average/solid players on the other team. It’s shit game design. If it wasn’t every lobby, then it’d be a non-issue, but that’s what a majority of what Advanced Warfare and Black Ops 3’s lobbies are like, so yes; it forces me to play in that manner, and it ruins the experience, hence why Black Ops 3 sucks, and why Vonderhaar is stupid for using K/D as a measurement for weapon balance.

          • CoDforever

            “It’s been a known fact that e-“Sports” can influence things like map design and matchmaking, if not more things. There’s no way that you can say that e-Sports didn’t influence anything with a straight face, because that would be an utter bullshit lie. And they definitely put tens of millions into it, if we were to include organization acquisitions.”

            eSports may influence maps, but thats a good thing. Balanced maps are good for everbody. Even if the maps were desgined for esports (which majority of them are not) I do not see what’s wrong with that. That would mean that every map is fair and balanced as possible and that no side of the map offers an advantage over the other. Now, to say that it influences matchmaking is a blatant lie. I already told you that SBMM has nothing do with competitive. If they made every playlist 4v4 and added esports ruleset to every game mode then I guess you could say that esports has influenced the public experience. But thats clearly not the case. No esports player wants to go around playing public TDM in competitive.

            The tens of millions they put in esports (more specifically acquiring MLG) was more than just for cod. They have around 5 other major esports (most of them which are bigger than cod esports) which MLG would benefit as well.

            “That’s just ignorant. Using the past year as an indicator, raw numbers via Arena and GB’s offer far more evidence than Twitch viewers because those who actually play it offer a bigger backbone to base how much the competitive scene has declined. A huge portion of the e-Sports crowd are toxic, and if you don’t believe that, then you have an even worse bias than I thought. Also, you can’t turn a casual game into a competitive one, and that’s been my point this whole time. CoD was never meant to be played competitively, Zampella laughed at even the thought of it.”

            Ok then, please tell the class what exactly are the raw numbers for Arena and MLG.

            “A huge portion of the e-Sports crowd are toxic”

            Now THATS ignorant. You’ve only seen 1 or 2 no-name teams act inappropriately which was years ago, and your saying that a majority of the esports crowd is like that? Its hilarious how you believe a minority of the community represents the majority.

            “Also, you can’t turn a casual game into a competitive one, and that’s been my point this whole time. CoD was never meant to be played competitively, Zampella laughed at even the thought of it.”

            You can turn a casual game into a competitive game by removing all of the casual aspects of it. Trip mines, C4, UAV, Care packages etc are all banned from competitive to ensure the highest skill ceiling possible. If we payed competitive with no competitive ruleset, then yeah it would be a joke. But we dont. And its funny how you bring up Zampella when Respawn were in talks of supporting esports with titanfall before that game died. Also Vahn used to hate esports but he changed his mind after being at an MLG event. I dont know what this even has to do with anything.

            “Have you played Advanced Warfare and Black Ops 3? That’s exactly what Skill-based Matchmaking (or scrub-based matchmaking) is. CoD IS advertised as a game where you shouldn’t take it very serious, hence casual gameplay. Nobody said that they wanted to play against bad players 100% of the time, I’m just tired of having a shitty team yet average/solid players on the other team. It’s shit game design. If it wasn’t every lobby, then it’d be a non-issue, but that’s what a majority of what Advanced Warfare and Black Ops 3’s lobbies are like, so yes; it forces me to play in that manner, and it ruins the experience, hence why Black Ops 3 sucks, and why Vonderhaar is stupid for using K/D as a measurement for weapon balance.”

            Extremely flawed logic here. If there was truly skill based matchmaking in the game then everybody would have around a 1.0 KD. But no, me and my friends are sitting here with about a 3+ KD. I have been paying cod for many years and have never noticed a difference in matchmaking other than Advanced Warfare.

            “I’m just tired of having a shitty team yet average/solid players on the other team. It’s shit game design.”

            You said it yourself. Its shit game design. Nothing to with esports.

            “it forces me to play in that manner” in what manner, exactly? If you get matched up with noobs then it forces the noobs to play in that manner, thus the never ending cycle of your flawed logic.

          • BradyAlucard[sillibk]

            “eSports may influence maps, but thats a good thing. Balanced maps are
            good for everbody. Even if the maps were desgined for esports (which
            majority of them are not) I do not see what’s wrong with that. That
            would mean that every map is fair and balanced as possible and that no
            side of the map offers an advantage over the other.”

            Oh come on, you literally said that it has nothing to do with public matches, and now you’re trying to justify it? I thought that you would have completely understood what I meant by “map design”; I’m not just talking about 3-lane symmetrical map design, I’m also talking about headglitching. My point was that e-Sports can influence public matches, and you pretty much agreed. And, no, it’s not a good thing, because of said headglitches. But yeah… it totally didn’t influence Advanced Warfare or anything. https://www.vg247.com/2015/03/31/how-esports-changed-call-of-duty/

            ” Now, to say that it influences matchmaking is a blatant lie. I already
            told you that SBMM has nothing do with competitive. If they made every
            playlist 4v4 and added esports ruleset to every game mode then I guess
            you could say that esports has influenced the public experience. But
            thats clearly not the case. No esports player wants to go around playing
            public TDM in competitive.”

            I’m having trouble fathoming the logic of what I just read… e-Sports modes like League Play completely revolve around skill-based matchmaking. Of course the developers put it in intentionally, *in order to force gamers to play the game in a more competitive member. Black Ops 2 was heavily influenced by the competitive mindset, and it’s completely why skill-based matchmaking existed. I’m shocked there’s even a disagreement, here.

            “The tens of millions they put in esports (more specifically acquiring
            MLG) was more than just for cod. They have around 5 other major esports
            (most of them which are bigger than cod esports) which MLG would benefit
            as well.”

            So you’re agreeing with me? This is all money that could potentially compromise the franchise’s budget, that’s my point. Whether it’s 100% for CoD or not, that’s still money wasted in order to improve the quality of the online experience such as more dedicated servers. But I’m interested in seeing where you got the “$3 million” statistic from, because that number seems completely random.

            “Ok then, please tell the class what exactly are the raw numbers for Arena and MLG.”

            The ones who actually play it, since live stream viewership is a mere minute shred of evidence, although it wouldn’t be practical to downplay it and say that it’s completely irrelevant, I’m definitely not saying that. Anyway, you look at games like CS:GO, with a decent player count, in which a pretty decent amount of them in competitive playlists, and then you look at CoD; the percentage of Black Ops 2’s and Ghosts’s in-game numbers vs. the majority of the user base was night and day; at least 5% of tens of million (that’s being generous, do 1-2 million players actually play competitively?). The issue? Not many CoD players are invested into e-Sports enough in order to actually play it. It’s no secret that CoD is declining, and I don’t think competitive is going to save it, not even in the slightest. If I were Activision and I wanted this to grow as a business rather than an everyday gamer, then I would try to translate competitive over in-game and try to increase its numbers in-game if it wants competitive to be taken seriously.

            “Now THATS ignorant. You’ve only seen 1 or 2 no-name teams act
            inappropriately which was years ago, and your saying that a majority of
            the esports crowd is like that? Its hilarious how you believe a minority
            of the community represents the majority.”

            No, what’s ignorant is not knowing someone at all and attempting to assume shit that’s not true; if it were about 1-2 “no-name teams”, then it’d be a non-issue, but you haven’t experienced what I’ve experienced, because you’re on their side. I won’t sugarcoat it; I think a majority of the e-Sports community is toxic. I’d say that the minority are the decent ones like Nadeshot, even though I think he has his own share of small issues.

            “You can turn a casual game into a competitive game by removing all of
            the casual aspects of it. Trip mines, C4, UAV, Care packages etc are all
            banned from competitive to ensure the highest skill ceiling possible.
            If we payed competitive with no competitive ruleset, then yeah it would
            be a joke. But we dont.”

            You missed the point completely. That completely ruins the game; you strip all of that shit out of the game, then what do you have left? Precisely my point; stop attempting to put competitive in games that never supported it publicly in the first place, because it only compromises what made that game fun in the first place. That’s a pretty big problem that I have.

            “But we dont. And its funny how you bring up Zampella when Respawn were
            in talks of supporting esports with titanfall before that game died.
            Also Vahn used to hate esports but he changed his mind after being at an
            MLG event. I dont know what this even has to do with anything.”

            I don’t remember that, but it’s weird that Zampella would change his mind all of a sudden, I guess too many players bitched. As for Vahn, yeah, he completely changed CoD’s future for the players that actually support the franchise by doing that. That makes me even more annoyed with competitive CoD. It’s interesting how that all worked out.

            “Extremely flawed logic here. If there was truly skill based matchmaking
            in the game then everybody would have around a 1.0 KD. But no, me and my
            friends are sitting here with about a 3+ KD. I have been paying cod for
            many years and have never noticed a difference in matchmaking other
            than Advanced Warfare.”

            I said that Black Ops 3 had scrub-based matchmaking, but it’s hard for me to say that it doesn’t have skill-based matchmaking when so many lobbies consist of tryhards on the other team and thumbless noobs on my team. That’s not a very enjoyable experience, and it’s not casual. Who asked for this awful matchmaking? It has to be the worst matchmaking next to Advanced Warfare’s. Also, it’s a fact that skill-based matchmaking exists for team balancing anyhow, and it’s a known fact that Black Ops 2 had skill-based matchmaking at launch.

            “You said it yourself. Its shit game design. Nothing to with esports.”

            It has everything to do with e-Sports, because e-Sports revolves around skill-based gameplay. What an ignorant thing to say.

            “If
            you get matched up with noobs then it forces the noobs to play in that
            manner, thus the never ending cycle of your flawed logic.”

            What the hell are you talking about? How is it flawed logic if it’s happening to everybody? It essentially makes the lobbies unfair, as well as them being retardedly close. Absolutely boring.

          • BradyAlucard[sillibk]

            (Clicked the post button too early; Vonderhaar using K/D as a measurement for game balance is like his bullshit “black box”. I guess Treyarch just lost their touch because Black Ops 3 is an abysmal online experience for a decent portion of the time. Everyone should have the chance to have fun by going positive, so forcing lobbies to put me up against tryhards 6-70% of the time is fucking retarded game design)

          • darren

            How does the NFL make my life better? It doesn’t. But I’m not gonna say get rid of football, because I would sound like an idiot, and it would piss off millions of peoole. But I think a lot of people have no real opinions of their own, but it doesn’t stop them from acting like they have one. If I go to websites enough, you see the same people. And you might think they are the most informed. They just like arguing. They say things like e sports being toxic, but are just as toxic here or in lobbies.

          • BradyAlucard[sillibk]

            Except for the fact that NFL is completely different because it’s an actual sport and all athletes get paid for their performances, whereas e-Sports aren’t actual sports besides the morons that want it to be. The funniest thing I’ve ever heard would be e-Sports morons calling Nadeshot an “athlete”. That’s just rich.

            There’s no debate. Nobody in the Call of Duty community are as toxic as “competitive” players and quickscopers. I don’t see any casual player, especially here, act so narcissistic and stupid.

          • darren

            So people on here aren’t toxic? Or the BO3 forums? Or in regular pub matches? You’re delusional.

          • BradyAlucard[sillibk]

            You seriously think that the general CoD community is as toxic as e-Sports morons and snipers? You’re the delusional one, it’s not even a debate.

          • darren

            Well, considering that I have never watched a match, I do not know any “professional” players, and my only experience has been with the general CoD community, yes, absolutely. Where is all of your experience in e-sports (that you hate so much) that you are the judge of where and who is toxic, in a game where everyone agrees that the Supply Drop business is bullshit, but here we are, beefin’? You, as I, are just as fucking toxic as those e-sport douches you claim are the worst.

          • BradyAlucard[sillibk]

            No, I wouldn’t say that we’re nearly as toxic as them (and snipers). With gamers, there is going to be toxicity anywhere. I don’t think I’ve seen anybody as bad as Xbox/PC corporate slaves, either. Unlike e-Sports pricks, you and I don’t talk down upon someone else just because they’re worse at a game than you, or act as narcissistic. It’s impossible to see eye-to-eye if nobody sees what I have for the past few years.

          • darren

            I could give a shit less about e sports. How has it affected my version of BO3? Why have an opinion about something you could care less about? I don’t get it. Let’s say tofu. “I’ve never had it. Never will. But I fucking hate tofu.” And you want to be taken seriously?

          • BradyAlucard[sillibk]

            When it does affect my $60 game in regards to things like the map design and features, then I have every right to have an opinion saying that it doesn’t belong. If it wasn’t so heavily integrated, then there would be no need for me to be so bothered by it. Come on, you’re smarter than that.

        • Drank Bleach

          Hey ScOott, you seem like a kewl and passionate cod fan, but going after Keshav is uncalled for. I and a lot others come here first for cod news. He doesn’t have to do what he does but he does it cause he loves call of duty as the next person hence why he puts on CI the latest leaks, images, etc. We might not all agree with everything and yeah say your opinion but going after Keshav like that us very petty.

          • BradyAlucard[sillibk]

            I don’t know, but I commend him for having balls.

          • ScOott

            I just wanted him to explain why he would not post an article..

        • BradyAlucard[sillibk]

          I’d appreciate it if you were to be careful with what you are saying. I don’t advocate for censorship in the slightest (I will transfer you to my past comments about SJW’s and why I don’t think that CoD should have female characters just because or to appease SJW’s), I just don’t want you banned for talking shit to a moderator. It can be gone about in a different manner, because it won’t be any better than the people in the Blackout movement wishing death on Activision.

        • darren

          Why should anyone take youtube seriously? Two days from now #black market butthurt assclowns is nothing. You can be the first to comment all you like, doesn’t change the fact that you sit around hitting a refresh button for a living.

          People know supply drops are bullshit. The people who buy them, know this, and do it anyway. You’re pissed you can’t afford it? Well, I can remember when only people who were better off had systems. But now, any scumfuck can get one, and you want me to side with an idiot? Not gonna do it. It didn’t take a “movement” to change my mind. The whole movement, is nothing but a movement.

          • ScOott

            I can’t afford a supply drop, ur just a very angry moron dude, one of many on this website..

      • Drank Bleach

        #fucktrump

    • Tuby

      He likes all the sperm in his mouth #activision puppet

    • Ak74u

      we need to get rid of supply drops because I don’t want the next cod to have supply drops again I can’t take another year of supply drops

    • Diego Diniz

      What do you mean with “Black Market out” ???

      • TheDemonOfHate

        Nobody buys CoD points or I think anything from the Black Market until a date (idk).

        • Diego Diniz

          Yeah Sure! I tried to spend 100 COD Points…just to see what happens and…NOTHING! only commom stuff…

          • TheDemonOfHate

            Exactly

    • Keshav Bhat

      No, we will not be posting any articles about the Black Market Black Out thing that’s going around.

      My position on Black Market Weapons is here: http://charlieintel.com/2016/03/25/opinion-post-launch-dlc-weapons-not-exclusively-supply-drops/

      And, I’d rather not associate CI with that movement, as I have seen how toxic and crazy some of the supporters are. When people within this “movement” comment on others’ work that “they should die” if they do not support it, I am not getting any where near it.

      I do not agree with the Black Market having weapons in it. I have never spent a single cent on Call of Duty Points, and never will because I do not have disposable income available to do so. I will continue to support customization items in Black Market + Supply Drops as that is fine.

      But I am not supporting the folks behind the “Black Market Black Out.”

      • Johtoboy

        “When people within this “movement” comment on others’ work that “they
        should die” if they do not support it, I am not getting any where near
        it.”

        That is pretty much every movement ever. Movements arise when people are upset about something. This attracts toxic people, no matter how noble the goals of the movement are.

        With that attitude, it sounds like you won’t be standing up for anything in your entire life.

        • Keshav Bhat

          I will and do stand up for things that matter to me and will continue to do so. I, however, will never support Black Market Black Out with how toxic the community is, and because of how it all started: 1 YouTuber, who doesn’t have the best record, creating something when they have not played CoD in a long time. Sorry if you don’t agree.

          • CoDforever

            Not to mention some of the stupidest shit he demanded and lied about.

        • darren

          Oh, it is so easy to take a stand, right? That’s why everyone is so smart and just behind their keyboards, playertags, and avatars. What do you know about Journalism and the laws associated? What would you know about a multibillion dollar company? I’m sorry, but accuse him of not standing up for anything, but you choose to believe in this movement? And we wonder what’s wrong with our country. I’m posted as Darren. Not #IAmThe WordGod. To me, you’re all pussies. Give a guy hell because he won’t position himself in line with you. I’ll say this, I wouldn’t post something I wouldn’t say in real life. Which is where intelligent people live.

      • ScOott

        I’ve said what I got to say below.. But like I said I never asked u to support anything.. I have no idea what ur talking about when u say death threats.. But that is a pretty stupid reason not spread the word that people are going out of their way not to use the supply drop system in protest, to try and increase the odds of getting a weapon…

        I was playing Bo2 once and some kid told me to suck my dad… It was “toxic comment” I never played Bo2.. No! How stupid.. U shouldn’t be supporting cod it self if ur worried about a toxic community lol..

        • Keshav Bhat

          I responded to your comment below.

        • SoulTaker

          Playing BO2 and some guy saying that to you is way different to the B.M.B movement. When you’re playing games online you probably don’t care what you’re saying or what is being said to you. If you’re in a movement aiming for change you should be a lot more mature, you shouldn’t reply to someone who gives constructive criticism to what you’re supporting with “You should drink bleach bitch.” “How’s the acti dick feel bro”, “get Activisions cock out of your ass” etc. I have a lot more comments to what was said to me when I gave whiteboy7thst a bit of constructive criticism about the way he’s handling this. I didn’t cuss, I didn’t call him names none of that just some plain mature criticism and his fanboys just jumped on me that’s why I’m glad C.I is not helping him or even talking about it he’s toxic as as hell and so is his fans. For gods sake Pewdiepie fans are probably more friendly than his subs.

          • ScOott

            Again, ur basing this whole thing on one guy and his fan Base, If u didn’t know the guy like me, I’m pretty sure u would think it sounds like a good idea..

            People are so fixated on someone “owning” this blackmailed blackout.. They have lost the meaning to it.. This should be bigger than a individual.. It shouldnt matter who came up with the idea, the guy who did, Ali a, pewdeepie.. The guy who ever it was should be irrelevant.. Doesn’t matter, is what my point is..

      • The movement is perfectly fine, it’s always the toxic people within the community that undermine all its worth.

        Also, we don’t necessarily want the site’s position on the matter or even their stance, rather, we want it to be reported as it is, as it’s happening right now among the community, because it really is picking up on some parts of the Internet. Yet, if the site refuses to make an article, it’s all fine.

        And more than ever do people have to start separating the player hate from Activision hate. Fans need to express their disapproval towards Activision, not others who purchase COD points or even disagree with the movement, since it’s their hard earned money and decisions they choose to make. Because who is the source of all this frustration? Activision, not the players.

        • ScOott

          He won’t respond to u, because u made a valid point, with out insults.

          U have to say ur an fagit
          E sports is poop
          Or u have to say he loves activison in a rude way..

          Other wise he will just ignore u..

          • I suppose it’s fine if he doesn’t reply… Just as long as he looks at my post.

            And I simply can’t resort to being… Disrespectful to anyone. At least, not anymore…

          • Bengal Tigger

            No man it really works, insult Keshav and he will be butthurt and start replying

          • He responded, but he responded well. Keshav is hella smart.

          • ScOott

            Just making sure he did..

        • CoDforever

          The black market black out has next to no effect for Activision since 99% of people that support the movement dont already purchase COD points anyways.

        • Keshav Bhat

          That makes no sense to me. How can I post something here without it reflecting what we believe? If I post about the Black Market black out, it will be assumed that we are in support of it — when I never will.

          Also, I am not going to explain why we will not post/share some YTers content here. It’s complicated, and I will leave it at that.

          Frustration exists, yes. But, the amount of people spending on COD points is SO MUCH higher than the amount not. That won’t change in the near term, with or without any black out. Just how MW3’s black out did not change much at all.

          • Mr_ysi42t96

            I’m totally with you bro ! The idea of supply drop is good without the weapons.

          • imBATMAN

            Just say you have no affiliation with the Black Market black out, and post about it informing others.

            But hey I get it if Activision’s D is far up in there, it’s always hard to get it out.

        • SoulTaker

          Have you not seen how toxic Whiteboy7thst is???As well as all the toxic comments in his videos about the whole movement I support no weapons in the black market and wish things could go back to the way it was during BO2 and Ghosts when it came to Micro-transactions but I in no way am going to support that goofball. I commented on his video once saying I basically somewhat agree on his opinion but disagreed on the way he was handling the situation and you know what happened?
          “You should drink bleach bitch.”
          “Fuck you you activision cock sucking bitch.”
          “How does the Activision dick feel bro.”
          Etc. Toxic as fuck I’m glad C.I isn’t doing anything to help promote what some toxic YouTuber has started.

      • What about all the toxic, vile, and hate comments that goes on beneath CI articles by a number of certain users?

        By saying your not supporting it simply because certain other people support it in the wrong way is stupid.

    • CoDforever

      The black market blackout is the stupidest idea because the only people that support the movement are the people that dont already purchase supply drops, so this whole black market movement has next to no effect on the COD points revenue stream for Activision.

      If you want to start a real movement to get rid of COD points, then get everybody to boycott the games and stop playing Bo3 and I guarantee you people wont do jackshit.

      • BradyAlucard[sillibk]

        Genius (I’m not being sarcastic). It’s not like Activision hasn’t been paying attention to Ghosts and Advanced Warfare’s numbers. I don’t care if they’re the “best selling titles of 2013 and 2014”; the sales of non-Treyarch CoD’s are obviously going down, no matter how small the difference is. That’s what I plan on doing. Unless the games look phenomenal, I’m personally not buying the next 2 CoD’s. I don’t know what I’ll do about Treyarch.

        As for Supply Drops, to speak on personal experience, there is no way to control it. I can’t get my loved ones to not buy CoD Points, because it makes them happy, no matter what I do, I can’t stop it from happening. That definitely equivalates to the casual gaming community, I predict. Then there are those pathetic YouTubers that spend thousands on the shit and STILL knowing what they’re doing is wrong, now THAT is the problem. YouTubers can be a disease to the gaming community.

      • ScOott

        Only because no one is doing it, I know two people that have brought CoD points who think it’s a good idea, if two became two thousand then it could work, but enough people don’t care or are too weak to attempt anything..

        Only the Cod community could bitch about something for so long and do nothing to resolve the problem, you will all still be crying about supply drops when the new cod drops..

        • CoDforever

          The only reason people even support the black out is because those people dont already purchase supply drops so it has no effect on them and in return has no effect on Activision. If the blackout was meant to be effective, then it would be about quitting the game altogether and then people wont support that because it would require them to stop playing the game, which would never happen especially if they cared enough to remove supply drops in the first place.

          People that buy supply drops are people that already have a disposable income and wont stop just because some randomn guy on the internet told him to do so. Your failing to realize that this whole supply drop problem is not unique to COD, its an industry wide problem. More and more games are starting to support a gambling RNG system and have had immense success doing it. If we want this out of COD then we have to get it out of all games in general.

          Im against supply drops now that they have put weapons in them but im never going to support the black market black out. Why? Because:

          1) The movement was started by an absolutely toxic and terrible youtuber that is trying his very best to become relevant again.

          2) Some of the claims and facts he spits out are extremely false, inaccurate and his demands are absolutely laughable

          3) He has absolutely no legal cases against activision, they havent done anything illegal and “Activision promotes gambling to little kids” is the stupidest most breakable argument ever. Even if he did have some what of a legal case on them then there would still be no point because Activisions lawyers would tear him to shreds.

          4) I dont purchase supply drops anyways so me supporting the movement does absolutely nothing. All this black market black out BS does is bring more spotlight to the franchise, which is the last thing we need to give Activision.

          • ScOott

            Not true, I’ve already told u I know two people that have stopped purchasing cod points due to this “movement” if people were to accept this it would of made a difference..

          • CoDforever

            yeah man, I meant to say that literally 5% of people that support the blackout may have actually stopped buying COD points which is such an insignificant number that there is no reason it should be reported here.

          • ScOott

            To increase that number? Make people aware, wasting our time talking about this lol..

          • darren

            Let’s say I’m just hearing this now.
            ” Huh? There’s some movement? Ha! Idiots.”
            Do you blame Ford for drunk driving? Do you blame Crest for cavities? No. We live in a capitalist society. But you’ll blame activision for trying to make money? I wish I would have came up with the idea of supply drops. Anyone would. Blame the assholes who have more money than sense, and ruin it for everyone. Activision sees the youtube assholes spending hundreds of dollars, and believes every gamer can do the same.

          • jordanxbrookes

            There’s making money and then there’s pure fucking disgusting greed. BIG DIFFERENCE.

          • darren

            Whatever. If you’re rich, are you gonna give it away? Whatever. Go to Russia or somewhere else if you have a problem with capitalism.

    • RdJokr

      This so-called movement is toxic as shit. It had potential to be something good, but all you see are Youtubers insulting each other, leading to the community filled with even more insults, rants and hates. Not to mention that the problem with this movement that the majority of their supporters are the ones who spent very little, or none on microtransactions. That’s never going to make a difference with Activision, who only sees us right now as entitled children whining and demanding things.

      • ScOott

        That’s where this has all gone wrong, people are looking at individuals instead of the cause.. Like u said it has potential to be something good, I dont follow the toxic bulshit, so as far as I’m aware the cause is still the same, a good idea..people are looking at other people’s actions instead of the cause which is ridiculous imo.. If normal people were to join eventually they would cancel out the toxic side, and it would be bigger than one person or a group of people.. It’s a shame people can’t see past that..

        • Mr_ysi42t96

          You’re forgetting about the kids who spend their parents money. They don’t give a fuck and will keep on spending on black market

        • RdJokr

          Normal people are enjoying the game and not caring about this shit, sadly.

          Right now, the only people associated with this movement are the super toxic YouTubers, particularly Whiteboy7thst. This guy rants endlessly, even saying that those who don’t support the movement are “traitors to the community”. I don’t think anyone would want to be associated with this guy if they support this movement. And I’m certain this is why Keshav and the team at CI don’t want any part of this either.

          • ScOott

            Exactly 100 percent agree, it’s just a shame it’s been preserved this way, when this should actually be bigger than individual people.. I can’t stand some YouTubers and views they have, but if they supported something like this I’d put that aside, this is was the best chance to fight back and get some good supply drop rates and it’s been wasted on personal opinions and emotions..

            It’s doomed to fail, and people will still be crying about supply drops for many years.

          • SoulTaker

            I wouldn’t want to associate myself with Whiteboy7thst his rants only lead to me getting a huge headache because of his annoying as voice as well as his god damn ego. He’s just trying to stir up controversy so he can once again become relevant in the COD community.

    • Lol.

    • tuby

      The Activision puppet record my message lol

      • tuby

        Removed

  • TfarTn

    I luv blak cocks tree

  • Hm, was Banzai really a fan favorite map? I answered that first question as no, it doesn’t look familiar.

    • Gamerazor247

      Been wondering the same thing… Lol.

    • GinsuVictim

      Meh, I like it.

    • EveryoneIsInsane

      I did like it back in the day, good small map with a great choke point over the bridge.

      New version though I just can’t recognise any part of the map, I think they changed a lot and removed the choke point bridge completely.

    • Bengal Tigger

      Never played it, should have brought seelow back

  • TRINI REAPER

    DLC trailer available through supply drops.

    • TheDemonOfHate

      hyon

    • To get supply drops, you first need to buy COD points to open supply drops to receive supply drops in order to open more supply drops for even more supply drops giving you a chance for supply drops.

      • TRINI REAPER

        Supply Dropception, also what’s with the #BlackMarketOut trend anyways, it’s not gonna stop activision from sending supply drops to next COD after another.

    • Aidan

      That joke is getting as annoying as supply drops are.

      • Justus Maximus

        Use cod points to get rid of those comments.

        • Aidan

          Haha. How original.

      • BradyAlucard[sillibk]

        Instead of making crummy jokes, let’s ask for no more Scrub-based Matchmaking and to make some actual changes to the game (those LMG’s are extremely powerful) instead of letting Activision ask for more money and trying to make competitive relevant over the things that are actually important.

        • Siftblade

          I think getting rid of supply drops is more important than both of those combined

          • BradyAlucard[sillibk]

            We all know that Supply Drops are never going to go away, and since that that is 100% objectively the case, I’d rather focus on other important issues, such as actually patching the game instead of asking for more money. Some guns are still overpowered and some are still extremely underpowered.

          • Jon

            I agree…..no one says you have to buy cod points. I have never purchased cod points and I don’t see any advantage it would give me if i did.

      • BigMacMan

        It’s literally everywhere in the YouTube comment section

  • Fariko PUBzZz

    As one of the guys behind the MW3 Blackout I support any Blackout that targets Activisions greed. Doubt Charlie Intel will cover it as it’s clear they don’t want to bite the hand that feeds them. When we did the MW3 blackout we had a few articles written about the movement. Only mid level Youtubers not on the Activision payroll did videos about it. So I don’t think it will do much unless Kmart, AnaI A or other big youtubers promote it.

    • Ak74u

      I remember that wasn’t that to get better servers and less lag in the game? I was like 17 at the time lol

    • Trinityvitaliaty

      IP address noted. Permanent Denial of service on any Activision software activated.You earned it Fariko;)

  • ToonToons22

    I mean, it looks like a cool map and everything, but I’ve never played Banzai before. I think they should have reimagined a World at War map that actually came with the game. It would be still pretty fun to play a remake of Makin or Castle even without the new Exo movements.

  • YoungMurf

    Looks absolutely nothing like Banzai. Man I miss the days when CoD used to be something else and not a sweat fest with these lame ass supply drops.

    • Ray

      It just went from looking like a war setting to looking like trash.

      • YoungMurf

        “Look familiar?” No.. no it doesn’t look familiar to any past CoD map for that matter.

    • Bengal Tigger

      CoD always had sweatfest players

      • YoungMurf

        Back in the MW/WaW days it wasn’t half as sweaty as it is now.

        • Bengal Tigger

          most people started back then

          • YoungMurf

            So because most people started with MW or WaW they were sweaty games? I didn’t find either very sweaty at all and yes there was gamebattles but that was nothing like the eSports is now.

          • Mario Rivera

            cod has had 11 games before bo3, as the the number of years cod racks up increases so do the amount of veterans. back in those days it was a lot less common to find ppl with 3+ years of cod experience than it is now.

          • Bengal Tigger

            I meant most people that stared playing CoD back then

        • darren

          In those days, there wasn’t much to the game. Now, you gotta sweat for the holiest of holies, Dark Matter. You gotta sweat the cryptokeys. You gotta sweat it all. The game itself, not the players, is what is sweaty.

      • BradyAlucard[sillibk]

        No, that wasn’t until they made SBMM more prevalent. I noticed a lot of “sweaty” players in Black Ops and MW3, but it didn’t get really bad until Black Ops 2, 3, and Advanced Chorefare.

        • Mario Rivera

          SBMM in all cods besides AW are pretty much non-existent. BO2 HAD strong SBMM but that was normalized early on in its lifecycle. Shortly after that, BO2 went on to be the best COD ever in the eyes of a lot of players. Its hard to argue BO3 and every other cod i havent mentioned has a significant amount of SBMM when im constantly matched up against .5 or lower kd players on a 2+kd account. So now that nonsense has been cast aside, its time for some simple logic… Cod has had 11 games prior to BO3, of course as the series chucks in years, more and more players become veterans. Nowadays, Its a lot easier to be matched up against some1 that has been playing COD for 3+ years than it was in MW3/BO1 days. Obviously veterans tend to know what they doing more than noobs do. That is the simple science that explains why people bitching about sweaties seems to increase every year. By the time cod 2016 comes along a new generation of noobs will graduate to veteran status and so on in cod 2017. People bitching about sweaties can only hope that the series can attract as many new players as it used to so dilutes the ratio of veterans in matchmaking.

          • BradyAlucard[sillibk]

            It’s hard for me to say that Black Ops 3 has “SKILL-based matchmaking”, because the matchmaking logic tends to be closer to putting me on a team of “scrubs” and facing players that are either similar skill of or better than me, and having extremely close games. That’s not how I want to play my $60 game, and that is my personal opinion. It’s not fun to carry a team and having my efforts wasted, only to get completely destroyed because my team are the “noobs” that you stated. In my opinion, the developers shouldn’t have to adapt a game’s design so that the new players have it easy. That’s the way that this franchise has always been, and it’s only gotten worse and worse. When we were all new, we got destroyed, and we learned after we had more and more experience, and now that we’re better, we shouldn’t accept playing against similar or better players in *every game*, in my opinion, that’s what the problem is. It’s not like I’m a “bad” player, either.

          • Argy

            While I think BO2 was a good game, I still don’t see it as the best CoD… Honestly most the things that made it “better” than other CoD games I had been asking for since MW2, but the cycle takes time to catch-up apparently.

          • Mario Rivera

            I never said that I or every1 thinks bo2 is the best cod, I just said many people say its the best. That’s a conversation i don’t feel like having so I made it a issue to choose my words carefully lol. My personal opinions differ from the cookie cutter masses that mold themselves to think like their favorite youtubers 🙂

        • Bengal Tigger

          tbh what you said was true

          • BradyAlucard[sillibk]

            Thx fam

  • JOE
  • Jeromie Hartsough

    I had to look at the #blackmarketblackout after reading the comments. I just want to make sure I understand, not buying COD points for 1 month is supposed to teach Activision a lesson? Shouldn’t we stop using the black market all together until Activision gets it together? It literally is like digging through a treasure chest filled with heroine needles and broken dreams so it wouldn’t hurt my feelings.

    • Aidan

      I think it’s actually 3 months.

  • Michael Romo

    That moment when all you want is a Makin remake

  • Diego Diniz

    We like SMALL/MEDIUM maps. The Bests maps ever are the small/medium:
    – Rust
    – Shipment / Showtime
    – Hijacked / Skyjacked
    – Combine
    – Scrapyard / Ignition

    etc etc etc…
    We DO NOT like Large Maps…

    • ben wills

      eww, no.

    • Mr_ysi42t96

      Not with thrust jumps m8

    • jordanxbrookes

      Sorry but I’m not part of the “We”. I like some of Call of Duty’s big maps like Derail, Array, Cracked, Overlord, Fallen and Interchange. Ideally I prefer Medium-Big maps like in Black Ops, but I don’t mind having a few small maps like Nuketown and Firing Range.

      • Guywithbrains

        Small maps: clusterf*ck, camping, spawn trapping…
        Medium to big maps: overall enjoyable, you get more time to breathe between kills because enemy won’t spawn too close to you

        Of course there are exceptions in small maps that are good gameplay design wise: for example Dome in my opinion. But Nuketown isn’t definitely one of those exceptions (although it is fun map, especially original Nuketown, when it comes to other aspects).

    • Aidan

      I like big maps.

  • Thug Turf

    The double edged sword of the Black Market Black Out is that the reason that Activision introduced the black market in Treyarch’s BO III is because of the failure that ghosts was commercially. Obviously CoD was in trouble and was losing many long time fans for the life span of ghosts. Many CoD Youtubers went through a depression due to the lack of care for Ghosts. Off the top of my head, the “Crew”, stopped making Ghosts videos and eventually CoD videos all together. People jumped to Counter Strike and other games. All of this leads us to where we are now, post ghosts Call of Duty. When people stopped playing, Activision had to act, thus creating a new source of revenue, ASD’s and now CoD points. It is scary because, if we all flat out boycott CoD points, what tactic will ATVI deploy next? On the other hand, if we go along with buying CoD points, will they see how much money they can pull out of us, gamers, one of the more willing to buy?
    It seems that no matter what we do, ATVI will pull whatever moves they need to pull in order to stay afloat and maximize profits. Black Market Black Out or not, we as a community are in for a wild rild, and this will only end with us dropping the series for good, or dropping money on whatever tactic ATVI will use next.

    • Mr_ysi42t96

      Nicely said, although I think only stupid people spend their money on cod points. It looks like I’m only going to buy cod every 3 years

    • GinsuVictim

      Ghosts isn’t to blame, Activision copying everyone else is. With BO2 and Ghosts, they did well selling customization packs, but went the Battlefield/CS:GO supply drop route after that because they saw a chance to squeeze more money out of us. They saw how successful loot crates were for the other guys and went, “We have more players than them!”

      • Thug Turf

        Whether or not either of us are correct, I find it ridiculous that anybody would want to partake in the purchasing of supply drops. For a game like CS:GO, I understand it, because it is a game that will be popular and played years from now, but BO III is a game that will lose a good portion of players as the years go by and new CoD’s come out with the same supply drop system intact. Obviously ATVI is playing us.

        • GinsuVictim

          Definitely agree with that post.

      • ben wills

        …microtransactions were never good

        • GinsuVictim

          I never said otherwise.

    • DEMOLITION12

      lol ghosts was not a failure

      • Thug Turf

        It wasn’t a failure, but in comparisons to other CoD’s, it wasn’t as great. It turned many people off of the series and led to where we are now.

    • thebulky1cometh

      “…it seems that no matter what we do, ATVI will pull whatever moves they need to pull in order to stay afloat and maximize profits.”

      Yes, this is the general formula for running a business.

      In all seriousness though, I think the only way to really impact a change is to hit them where it hurts: the bottom line. In other words, if the games stop selling, then and only then will theu really care about making changes (to sell more games).

  • Diego Diniz

    MORE GUN FREE MAN !!!